Activist Hu Jia Gets Three and a Half Years

i'm a chinese.
so i surpport my government.

I apologize for missing April 1st to share this piece about awards that somebody sent to me through email.

1. According to unconfirmed sources, Ms. Nancy Pelosi has been given the highest honor, “The People’s Hero Medal” by the Propaganda Department of Chinese Communist Party Central Committee. This award was given for her "unique and outstanding contribution in strengthening CCP central leadership by stirring up profound hatred and suspicion among the Chinese people against the USA government and US democracy".

2. According to a unconfirmed secret report from the Chinese State Security Ministry, the senior leadership team of CNN was recognized Tuesday in a closed door working session of the Standing Committee of CCP Political Bureau. Chairman Hu expressed his appreciations for the “underground party comrades working at CNN as editors and writers. They did an excellent job of distorting facts about what happened in Tibet. Their work powerfully assisted us in helping the Chinese people to see clearly that their enemies were Western democracies and Western governments, and Western medias are liars while the party always tells the truth. I have instructed the State Security Ministry to send an encrypted message about my thanks to the CCP CNN General Committee: good job, comrades, and the way to go! However, the final victory of the revolution has not been won and comrades at CNN have to work harder to provoke the Chinese people.”

3. The generals of the Chinese Liberation Army sent many bottles of high quality French wine made in 1949 to their friends in Pentagon to thank them for periodically sending US aircraft battle groups to Taiwan Strait and deploying high performance stealth bombers and fighters in Japan. One Chinese air force general called his US counterpart and shared a grateful moment: “Thank you so much, my friend and it worked as we planned. When I told the boss in Beijing that your F-35 stealth fighter bomber deployed in Japan could break through all Chinese air defenses and threat the safety of leadership compound in Beijing, his face suddenly was frozen. Soon, I got 30 billion US dollars to buy and build long range precision cruise missiles that can attack and destroy aircraft carriers and land based air force bases. Thank you so much, old buddy, you are such a true friend. I will do my part too as we agreed. I will do an ISBC missiles test next month working with the Second Artillery commander in chief to help with that budget increase proposal of yours.”

I apologize for missing April 1st to share this piece about awards that somebody sent to me through email.

1. According to unconfirmed sources, Ms. Nancy Pelosi has been given the highest honor, “The Medal of The People’s Hero” by the Propaganda Department of Chinese Communist Party Central Committee. This award was given to her for her unique and outstanding contribution in strengthening CCP leadership by stirring up profound hatred and suspicion among the Chinese people against the USA government and US style democracy.

2. The senior leadership team of CNN was recognized Tuesday in a closed door working session of the Standing Committee of CCP Political Bureau. Chairman Hu expressed his appreciations for the “underground party comrades working at CNN as editors and writers. They did an excellent job of distorting facts about what happened in Tibet. Their work powerfully assisted us in helping the Chinese people to see clearly that their enemies were Western democracies and Western governments, and the Western medias were liars while the party always told the truth. I have instructed the State Security Ministry to send an encrypted message to the CCP CNN General Committee: the final victory of the revolution has not been won and comrades at CNN have to work harder to provoke the Chinese people.”

3. According to the email, The generals of the Chinese Liberation Army are said to have sent many bottles of high quality French wine made in 1949 to their friends in Pentagon to thank them for periodically sending US aircraft battle group to Taiwan Strait and deploying high performance stealth bombers and fighters to Japan. One Chinese air force general called his US counterpart and shared a grateful moment: “Thank you so much, my friend, and it worked as planned. When I told the boss in Beijing that your F-35 stealth fighter bomber deployed in Japan can break through all Chinese air defenses and threat the safety of leadership compound in Beijing, his face suddenly was frozen. Soon, I got 30 billion US dollar to buy and build long range precision cruise missiles that can attack and destroy aircraft carriers and land based air force bases. Thank you so much, old buddy, you are such a true friend. I will do my part too. I will carry out an ISBC missiles test next month working with the Second Artillery commander in chief to help with that budget increase proposal of yours.”

I apologize for missing April 1st to share this piece about awards that somebody sent to me through email.

1. According to unconfirmed sources, Ms. Nancy Pelosi has been given the highest honor, “The Medal of The People’s Hero” by the Propaganda Department of Chinese Communist Party Central Committee. This award was given to her for her unique and outstanding contribution in strengthening CCP leadership by stirring up profound hatred and suspicion among the Chinese people against the American government and American style democracy.

2. The senior leadership team of CNN was recognized Tuesday in a closed door working session of the Standing Committee of CCP Political Bureau. Chairman Hu expressed his appreciations for the “underground party comrades working at CNN as editors and writers. They did an excellent job of distorting facts about what happened in Tibet. Their work powerfully assisted us in helping the Chinese people to see clearly that their enemies were Western democracies and Western governments, and the Western medias were liars while the party always told the truth. I have instructed the State Security Ministry to send an encrypted message to the CCP CNN General Committee: the final victory of the revolution has not been won and comrades at CNN have to work harder to provoke the Chinese people.”

3. According to the email, The generals of the Chinese Liberation Army are said to have sent many bottles of high quality French wine made in 1949 to their friends in Pentagon to thank them for periodically sending American aircraft battle groups to Taiwan Strait and deploying high performance stealth bombers and fighters at Japan. One Chinese air force general called his US counterpart and shared a grateful moment: “Thank you so much, my friend, and it worked as planned. When I told the boss in Beijing that your F-35 stealth fighter bomber deployed in Japan can break through all Chinese air defenses and threat the safety of leadership compound in Beijing, his face suddenly was frozen. Soon, I got 30 billion US dollar to buy and build long range precision cruise missiles that can attack and destroy aircraft carriers and land based air force bases. Thank you so much, old buddy, you are such a true friend. I will do my part too. I will carry out an ISBC missiles test next month working with the Second Artillery commander in chief to help with that budget increase proposal of yours.”

Its interesting to see what's gonna happen next. He might have to serve out his sentence or maybe President Bush might request his release.

But, do you recall Wei JingSheng? He's proven to be a trouble-maker outside China. Did you know he weighed in on the Lahsa riot too? He hasn't helped with the climate. Click for details:

"HuJia sentenced to 3.5 years - did human rights activists scored another reckless point?"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/hujia-sentenced.html

Simon, what "airsand" said seems to indicate that those western medias are paying the price for their lies on the Tibet issue now
Some Western medias' credit has gone bankrupt among Chinese
Those Chinese began to oppose what the Western medias support unconditionally, no matter if they are right or not

But for me,my attitude depends on whether Hu Jia is in violation of the law or not. However, the Chinese government really has to improve the freedom of media
I just take a look at Hu Jia's article --奥运前的中国真相, and I personally don't think the article has anything to do with "煽动颠覆国家政权"
Although I'm not sure if all the things in the article is a real fact, but I am quite sure I really don't like falun gong, falun gong is an evil cult, definitely
and then,I am a Christian, half Christian ,and I go to church for times since 2002.
I also attend a family church in Beijing in 2007,and I never hear of any restrictions on freedom of religion

lol.DavidRSmith:
You guy has a great sense of humor.You did a good job.The reaction ,lunched by chinese netizenships,against the CNN and other wester media's untrue and biased reports on Tebit unrest this time really made them a great suprise.They have never thought we can do that.That means the day that they can cheat the kindness people across the world has gone by.We should work hard so that we can tune up our voice in the world.

hello, DavidRSmith:

"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!
"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!
"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!
"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!

hahahahahha...

According to totally confirmed sources,CNN's report on china and Simon Elegant's shameless words are always unconfirmed.

DavidRSmith:

"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!

oh,yes!!
these "unconfirmed sources" just make your shamelessness much more confirmed!!!!

According to totally confirmed sources,CNN's report on china and Simon Elegant's bias against china are always unconfirmed.

YES!!! LONG LONG LIFE CNN'S UNCONFIRMED SOURCES.

DavidRSmith:

"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!

oh,yes!!
these "unconfirmed sources" just make your shamelessness much more confirmed!!!!

According to totally confirmed sources,CNN's report on china and Simon Elegant's bias against china are always unconfirmed.

YES!!! LONG LONG LIFE CNN'S UNCONFIRMED SOURCES.

DavidRSmith:

"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!
"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!
"According to unconfirmed sources"?!?!?!

oh,yes!!
these "unconfirmed sources" just make your shamelessness much more confirmed!!!!

According to totally confirmed sources,CNN's report on china and Simon Elegant's bias against china are always unconfirmed.

YES!!! LONG LONG LIFE CNN'S UNCONFIRMED SOURCES.

hello, DavidRSmith,

Wow! I've always thought Simon Elegant was working for the CIA, I just didn't realize that he is actually a double agent working for the Chinese intelligence. Thanks for clearing that fact.

Saul Midmay;

WHAT??!!!Simon Elegant was working for the CIA and double agent working for the Chinese intelligence?????

is it confirmed or unconfirmed?

ok, let's say it is half confirmed!
hehehehe

Dear Readers,

Some of you might have heard too that Nancy Pelosi is in the news again because she sent a letter along with 15 other US politicians to urge President Bush to not attent the opening ceremony of the Olympics.

I guess she considers herself a "human rights" champion. However, she doesn't seem to understand U.S. government's obligation on the world-stage. China won fair and square to host the Olympics. How about dropping politics and be a good sport for once?

"Nancy Pelosi - a little respect, please"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/nancy-pelosi--.html?cid=109231668#comment-109231668

@DavidRSmith
很傻很天真，很CNN ^_^

Can you guys have a sense of humour? David just posted a late April 1 joke that is quite telling.

i can hardly have a sense of humour after reading simon's provocative blog.
well....i think that's because simon has some sort of "mind control power"......so he took away people's sense of humour.....
well done , simon....

i can hardly have a sense of humour after reading simon's provocative blog.
well....i think that's because simon has some sort of "mind control power"......so he took away people's sense of humour.....
well done , simon....

i can hardly have a sense of humour after reading simon's provocative blog.
well....i think that's because simon has some sort of "mind control power"......so he took away people's sense of humour.....
well done , simon....

i can hardly have a sense of humour after reading simon's provocative blog.
well....i think that's because simon has some sort of "mind control power"......so he took away people's sense of humour.....
well done , simon....

inciting the overthrow of state power" (煽动颠覆国家政权罪).

too strict!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

release those just write something gov't dislike!

China, helping the white hegemony, spilt on her dear friend to the IAEA, the agency closed down Iraq's nuclear program:

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5jHz-Bz3Pa0Ivga_oNIvTbrBoIN7QD8VPV9Q80

I am a Chinese citizen. I am furious and out of word for this government. I am ashamed to be part of this society, where a good person like Hu Jia was found guilty for being honest. There is no justice in this country.

I am a Chinese citizen. I am furious and out of word about this government. I am ashamed to be part of this society, where a good man like Hu Jia was found guilty for being honest. There is no justice in this country.

lol @ DavidRSmith

#1 is just plain funny as well as #2. #3 I wouldn't put past the hawks in either government -.- In fact, it makes a lot of sense >.>

Are we sure that the cold war wasn't just a big scam by various top dogs to further their careers?! I sense a conspiricy theory!!

I think I just hurt my funny bone... *.*;;

I feel very sorry for Hu Jia and his family. Hu Jia does not deserve any jail time. He wanted to help poor, undereducated and powerless Chinese people. He might have lacked a bit of strategies. Some of his words might have been too aggressive from the viewpoints of many sullen-faced Chinese officials. I’d like to say that his intention is noble, yet his timing is completely wrong especially now when there are so many foreign organizations trying to get the best out of a very politically engaged Beijing Olympics. Besides, it is a Chinese way to kill a chicken in front of monkeys in order to “harmonize the Chinese society”.

My dear Chinese folks,
For now, please do not make more troubles for the Chinese government, thus for yourselves. I hope that the restrictions will be loosened when the Olympic dust settles.

Thanks to the overwhelming support from Chinese citizens of the government, especially in protecting the rule of the current government in China, the Chinese government is free to do whatever it wants to anybody that dare to raise a voice about what is really happening in China. Chinese people need a harmonized China, not one with any voice of disagreement. We must allow the Chinese people, in particular, the Chinese government, to continue to allow Chinese people to know only the official versions of truth, so that we will not hurt the feeling of the Chinese people, who are so delicate and feeble.

By the way, sense of humour is a reflection of civility. Not all people are capable of having a good laugh, especially about themselves. We must forgive those lacking sense of humour.

@Mimi

You have a mature view of Hu Jia's situation.

@ Everybody

Can someobdy point out the reporter on CCTV who is now very famous in China for shedding spotlights on those less fortunate in China. Its entirely possible to do activism in China within Chinese law and with China's interests at heart.

I believe there are many well meaning activists in China. However, those who get in trouble are the ones too naive and somehow become victims of collaboration with Western entities the Chinese government deem harmful to China.

HRM, Amnesty Internation, etc are way self-righteous to understand this point. They don't believe in internation law or rule of law within a country.

@John Smith

omg, you are still here!

Once again, the only Chinese voice those racism journalists are interested are from those who agree with them. Everyone else is either "rabidly nationalistic" or "brainwashed".

There is a breed of Chinese dissidents who are funded y NED/CIA/Taiwan government. They have been very cooperatives with western powers in containing China. I have pity on them as that is the only way many of them actually make living on.

But they are not enjoying any sizable support among Chinese. The only support they are getting are from the hostile powers.

This gets to my original point. For those racist journalists, they want to report what conforms to their recist's view of the world. They obssession with those dissidents have more to do with the fact that the acts of those dissidents fit their racist's view.

Note even racist organization like Aryan Nation used to have black members.

好极了。东风万里传捷报，祖国处处红旗飘。就是要把反动分子都绳之以法。

I have no knowledge about Hu Jia's case. But I guess that he'll be released before the Game, based on similar cases in the past. He now becomes one of the little bargaring chips of the Chinese Government. The Government will use that chip to show a little compromise to the West while stand firm on the issues of political reform and Tibet for which they have a overwhelming popular support in China.
The problem with the Chinese right activists is that they have too close tie with the West but are out of touch with their own people. The ordinanry people are disillusioned, or even scared, by what have happened in the East Europe, the former Soviet Union and Iraq. They care more about economy, security, education, health care than abstract freedom and democracy. They also want peace and stability and have a strong nationalist sentiment. Failing to understand and address people's real concern, the activists are making themselves irrelevant and vulnerable.
For those behind the recent riot, I think they miscalculated the firmness and reaction of the Government and the Chinese majority. It will cause a backlash that leads to a stronger government control and less freedom. It shows that appeasement policy implemented in the past 30 years is not working, may serve to encourage independence aspiration, disrupt social order and distablize the region. The blind criticism of the west media and politicians just help the Goverment to rally support among the Chinese people.
Too much madness and too little wisdom nowadays. Sigh

Dear Ms. Pelosi,

I noticed your call to boycott Beijing Olympics. A number of my coworkers, along with I myself, are quite puzzled by your motion because we have been working very hard to get a worldwide program going within our company to support our Olympic Team.

In addition, we feel that this is going to offend the majority of Chinese people within and without China. We believe that it is hurting the long-term interests of the United States of America. We, the Americans, are already the biggest loser in this tragic Tibet incident, because of the way we have managed this tragedy as a nation, not only you, but the media as well as other political leaders.

I will stop writing to you Mr. Pelosi, because I am afraid that you are not listening. It is not hard to understand. Why such a powerful and wealthy character like you should listen to an ordinary American like me? I give up. Instead, I will be working hard along with many coworkers and Asian Americans in the community to support our athletes and Beijing Olympics. Yes, we will work hard to support our athletes to win in Beijing.

I have volunteered a month of my time to work in Beijing for Beijing Olympics. In addition, in the past several years, I have been volunteering my time to support my company’s strategic initiative with our outstanding Chinese partners. I will continue this work.

I am very disappointed that some of our best political talents are so waywardly lost in the dark lane of passé and impasse. Whey can you, Ms Pelosi, along with some of your friends in congress, wake up from the repugnant nightmare of yesterday? Only if you raise your head, be positive, and aspire for a better future, you can see the morning glory of hope for a new world of interdependency and interconnectivity.

My final offer of advice comes from ancient Egypt. In Egyptian mythology, God Anubis was the gatekeeper to decide where a soul should go. Anubis would evaluate the heart of the soul on scales against the Feather of Truth. If the heart was lighter than the Feather of Truth, the soul would be led to Osiris, the God of the second world. Otherwise, if the heart was heavy with conceit and lies and heavier than the Feather of Truth, the soul would be destroyed.

Mr Pelosi, every American is God Anubis. They are weighing your heart against the Feather of Truth every second of the day. People are intelligent. Their judgment is insightful and objective. Be aware of this and take nothing for granted. You have to prove yourself all over again everyday and you have to win their support to survive. Do not betray their long-term interests. If you do, they will know, because they know if your heart is heavier than the Feather of Truth.

Respectfully yours,

David

A Chinese American

Dear Ms. Pelosi,

I noticed your call to boycott Beijing Olympics. A number of my coworkers, along with I myself, are quite puzzled by your motion because we have been working very hard to get a worldwide program going within our company to support our Olympic Team.

In addition, we feel that this is going to offend the majority of Chinese people within and without China. We believe that it is hurting the long-term interests of the United States of America. We, the Americans, are already the biggest loser in this tragic Tibet incident, because of the way we have managed this tragedy as a nation, not only you, but the media as well as other political leaders.

I will stop writing to you Mr. Pelosi, because I am afraid that you are not listening. It is not hard to understand. Why such a powerful and wealthy character like you should listen to an ordinary American like me? I give up. Instead, I will be working hard along with many coworkers and Asian Americans in the community to support our athletes and Beijing Olympics. Yes, we will work hard to support our athletes to win in Beijing.

I have volunteered a month of my time to work in Beijing for Beijing Olympics. In addition, in the past several years, I have been volunteering my time to support my company’s strategic initiative with our outstanding Chinese partners. I will continue this work.

I am very disappointed that some of our best political talents are so waywardly lost in the dark lane of passé and impasse. When can you, Ms Pelosi, along with some of your friends in congress, wake up from the repugnant nightmare of yesterday? Only if you raise your head, be positive, and aspire for a better future, you can see the morning glory of hope for a new world of interdependency and interconnectivity.

My final offer of advice comes from ancient Egypt. In Egyptian mythology, God Anubis was the gatekeeper to decide where a soul should go. Anubis would evaluate the heart of the soul on scales against the Feather of Truth. If the heart was lighter than the Feather of Truth, the soul would be led to Osiris, the God of the second world. Otherwise, if the heart was heavy with conceit and lies and heavier than the Feather of Truth, the soul would be destroyed.

Mr Pelosi, every American is God Anubis. They are weighing your heart against the Feather of Truth every second of the day. People are intelligent. Their judgment is insightful and objective. Be aware of this and take nothing for granted. You have to prove yourself all over again everyday and you have to win their support to survive. Do not betray their long-term interests. If you do, they will know, because they know if your heart is heavier than the Feather of Truth.

Respectfully yours,

David

A Chinese American

I am very puzzled why foreigners are so interested in interrupting chinese people's business.You are not a judge.If you want to make a judgement, please give your conclusion which is based on confirmed evidence.

From the Tibet Issue, I realise that the soul of all chinese ppl is gathered tightly.The coming rumour only make the our ppl love our country more.This fact should have given a heavy punch to the ppl with unforseeable aim.

Since ancient times most top millionaires have been Chinese and we don't need this western rubbish liers and racists trying to throw mud in our eye!!!

The efforts that the western people spent to support the splittism of Tibet have no negative impact to the Chinese government at all. In fact, they are strongly helping the Chinese government getting support from Chinese people all over the world.

"好极了。东风万里传捷报，祖国处处红旗飘。就是要把反动分子都绳之以法。"

"Excellent! The eastern wind has carried news of success for tens of thousands of miles, and the motherland's red flag flutters everywhere. Reactionaries must all be brought to justice!"

Reactonaries? Really? Are you serious? ....no comment....

hujia again?
I'd really sympothize with him if he wasnt on the payrol of US government.
http://www.ned.org/grants/06programs/grants-asia06.html#china

Beijing Zhiaixing Information Counseling Center
$179,113*
To operate a diverse program promoting accountability and human rights. The work of the Institute will include legal aid, investigative reporting, activist training, and human rights documentation related to HIV/AIDS and other public health threats.

1.4Million RMB per year, that's a lot.

why do all these democracy activists in China
have to sell their souls to the Us government?

By the way, NED mistakenly wrote Aizhixing as Zhiaixing.

http://www.aizhi.net/

This is the Chinese website of Aizhixing where Hujia works at, look at left hand corner. Mei Guo Min Zhu Ji Jin Hui-----NED

The Nationalist government of china would not have all its economic power if it cared for its people properly. When a government lost in ambition/self image, its important for civil right experts to keep a spotlight on ambitious gov big wigs, remember a wise person learns from its mistakes, an authoritarian government power rest on the good citizens shoulders. it makes sense that government jobs are the best paying...that the cream of the crop with any sense either leave the country or join the government.
conservative governments do the same all over the globe. the word autonomy is synonymous with a cold bath in the morning

Unfortunate for the hard working people who have no voice in a selfish government, getting paid pennies when the government workers make millions.

You're right huaren, Amnesty International doesn't care about a country's internal laws. They ONLY care about human rights. They have no respect for laws or governments that abuse those rights. Something wrong with that belief?

Read the story about Gao Zhisheng and Teng Biaoget and get back to me.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yl5erzE-z3U&feature=related - 46k

"When a government lost in ambition/self image, its important for civil right experts to keep a spotlight on ambitious gov big wigs, remember a wise person learns from its mistakes, an authoritarian government power rest on the good citizens shoulders. "
Posted by tom mayo | April 4, 2008 7:34 AM

Are you talking about the U.S. or China? :P

Cause honestly, I can't tell :P

Here are some comments from slate forum about Kristof's column. I tried to post them on Kristof's blog but they are not showing up.

**********************
Finally, as to Nicholas Kristof’s editorial in the 4/3/08 NYT:

--He says hold off on a boycott of the Olympics and keep the pressure on PRC—okay, but be prepared for every Olympics to be used as political leverage because no country is perfect. In fact given that almost every Olympics until the last couple of decades was hosted by a colonial empire, an apartheid state or the odd hard left or right dictatorship this approach could had been used in the past so that the Games would’ve faced a boycott with clockwork regularity.

--He suggests that Bush balance his trip to the Beijing Games with a trip to a Tibetan area—it isn’t Bush’s choice where he can travel within China, so this evidence of Kristof’s arrogance. We wouldn’t allow Hu Jintao to go on a propaganda junket to a Black neighborhood in New Orleans so he could highlight our Hurricane Katrina problems.

--Kristof’s suggestion that the Dalai Lama be allowed to assume power in Lhasa or that Han movement should be limited in their own country are also examples of the West telling the non-West to do things we’d never agree to do. China will wait until the Dalai Lama reincarnates into a Dalai Lama that is loyal to Beijing—just like they did with the Panchen Lama. The PRC doesn’t allow the Vatican to appoint bishops in the Chinese Catholic Church either. They allow worship but limit the use of religion when it furthers foreign control , challenges political stability or encourages ethnic nationalism.

--Kristof’s flawed thinking is exemplified by his comparison of the way the US and the PRC “tread clumsily on the nationalism of others.” He provides Vietnam and Iraq as examples for the US, and Xinjiang and Tibet for the PRC. The big difference is that Vietnam and Iraq are foreign countries the US invaded and Xinjiang and Tibet are areas that were incorporated into China during the Qing Dynasty, if not earlier. A better analogy would be to point to the US treading on Mexican nationalism in Texas or California. If the PRC tried to address this issue we’d laugh in their collective faces.

--Kristof also compares the US’s and PRC’s “petulant “ refusal to deal with others they don’t like—Iran and Cuba for the US and the Dalai Lama for the PRC. Again he compares our refusal to deal with foreign countries to the PRC’s refusal to deal with someone who they see as a threat to the internal stability of their own nation.

--Finally he supports assimilation, albeit perhaps unintentionally. He points to Tibetan anger at the success of Han shop keepers, who are “better educated” and “more entrepreneurial.” The US, UK, France and other western countries dealt with this anger by educating and assimilating minorities into mainstream society.

@Zhihua, Zhangsan

The US and China Today Blog is carrying you guys comments too:

"Nicholas D. Kristof/NYT asked Chinese for input, but did he consider their perspectives?"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/nicholas-d-kr-1.html?cid=109446700#comment-109446700

Je suis un chinoise, pass 4 annes en france pour DEUG ET LIENCE. Je trouve une bonne chose concernant boycotte. J la traduit en chinois et mis deja en internet de la chine….. je crois que il a ete lu des centaines millies de fois….
Pascal Boniface is Director of the Institute for International and Strategic relations, Paris (IRIS). Pascla boniface， 法国巴黎国际战略关系学院主任。

法国学者看抵制奥运----
Prix de boycotte JO BEKIN 抵制北京奥运的代价
Pascal Boniface : Bonjour.
LAL : Pensez-vous réellement que les pays qui ont des intérêts commerciaux avec la Chine puissent boycotter les JO de Pékin ?
您认为，那些和中国有商业利益的国家真的能抵制北京奥运会吗？
Pascal Boniface : Sauf en cas de dégradation très forte de la situation, on peut penser qu'un boycott des Jeux olympiques est exclu, car un pays qui prendrait l'initiative du boycott serait considéré comme non seulement inamical, mais presque comme ennemi par la Chine, et effectivement, il en paierait un prix économique et commercial très lourd. Par ailleurs, un boycott, pour être efficace, ne peut pas se faire de façon individuelle, il doit être fait de façon collective.
除非（西藏）情况变得非常的糟糕，抵制的可能性更本不存在，因为那个发起抵制的国家，将会不仅仅被中国认为不友好国家，而且会认为是中国的敌人。并且，无疑会付出非常沉重的经贸代价。除非，这个抵制不是单一国家的抵制，而是一个集体的抵制。
Carlos Cardoso : Cependant d'autres "prises de position" sont envisagées, comme par exemple le boycott de la cérémonie d'ouverture. Quelle sera la réaction probable des autorités chinoises aux prises de position possibles qui se trouveraient à la limite de ce que la charte olympique stipule ?
如果是作出抵制奥运会开幕式这样一个姿态上的表示呢？面对这个局限于奥运会宪章体制内的行动，中国的反映将会是什么？
Pascal Boniface : Là aussi, la réponse est la même. S'il devait y avoir boycott par les chefs d'Etat et de gouvernement de la cérémonie d'ouverture, il faut que cela soit collectif, parce qu'un boycott individuel n'aurait aucun impact et serait beaucoup plus risqué. On constate par ailleurs qu'en dehors de la position des chefs d'Etat, de nombreux sportifs ont déclaré vouloir se rendre à Pékin et entreprendre là-bas une action qui attire l'attention sur la question des droits de l'homme. Et de ne pas être des acteurs muets et aveugles par rapport à la situation.
同样的回答。假如政府首脑真的抵制奥运会，这必须是一个集体的行为。因为一个单一国家的抵制，不会有任何效果，反而对他们自己更加危险。其实除了国家元首外，很多运动员都表示愿意去北京，然后再采取一些表达对人权关注的行动，而不会装聋作哑。
Nico : Le boycott des Jeux de Pékin pourrait-il représenter le
commencement d'une future scission profonde entre les blocs occidental et chinois?
抵制奥运会的行动会不会代表着西方世界和中国对抗的开始？
Pascal Boniface : Une scission profonde, non. Cela ouvrirait bien sûr une crise, mais qui, comme toute crise, peut être durable ou passagère selon les réactions ultérieures des uns et des autres. Mais il est certain que cela serait ressenti comme un affront par les dirigeants chinois, et probablement par une partie de l'opinion chinoise.
一个激励的对抗，不会。但是这会是个危机，但就像其他的危机一样，可能是一个持续性的或者短期性的危机，这要看以后各方面具体的反映来看。但是毫无疑问，对于中国领导人来说，这将会被认为是一个耻辱，并且可能对于一部分中国人来说，也是如此。（译者：可能？？？ 一部分中国人？？？ 抵制？ 不要敌视１３亿人民，中国人民愿意微笑着面对世界，希望世界也微笑着面对中国. Translator: probablement??? Une partie de chinoise ??? I am afraid it’s absolutly and 1.3 billiard chinese… chinese is smiling to the world, the world will also smile to chinese.）

LONDRES DANS UNE POSITION PARTICULIÈRE
archambau : L'Union européenne, par son poids politique et géographique, peut être influente dans le monde si elle reste unie. Or ne risque-t-elle pas une fois de plus de se décrédibiliser sur la scène internationale si les pays membres n'adoptent pas une position commune à l'égard de la Chine ?
伦敦，一个特殊情况
一个统一的欧盟，以她的政治和地理分量，是可以影响世界的。假如在对中国一事件上，不能达成一个统一的看法，欧盟会不会更进一步失去信心和国际威信？
Pascal Boniface : Oui, effectivement, il vaudrait mieux que les Vingt-Sept prennent une position commune. Outre les différences d'appréciation qu'il peut y avoir sur la façon de réagir, on a vu qu'il y a un pays qui est dans une situation tout à fait particulière, c'est la Grande-Bretagne, puisqu'elle sera le prochain hôte des Jeux. Et donc les Britanniques vont très naturellement être les plus modérés dans la réaction, parce qu'ils n'ont pas envie de subir un éventuel contrecoup en 2012. Il faudra bien trouver un compromis, car les Britanniques ne peuvent pas non plus être isolés par rapport aux autres membres de l'UE.
是的，这是一定的。最好27个国家能够采取统一行动。关于采取怎样的立场，各个国家都有不同的观点，但是有个国家是非常特别，就是英国，她将是下一个奥运会的举办国。所以自然的英国采取了非常谨慎的态度，因为她不愿意在2012年得到同样的反击。但是她又必须和欧洲国家达成一定的妥协，以免被其他成员国孤立。
mehdi : En dehors des pays occidentaux, connaît-on la position diplomatique sur ce sujet des autres grands pays de la scène mondiale ? Je pense notamment à la Russie ou à l'Iran.
除了欧洲国家外，其他的大国采取了什么样的外交立场？特别是俄国和伊朗？
Pascal Boniface : Ils n'ont pas la même sensibilité que les pays occidentaux à ce qui se passe en Chine. D'une part, parce que ce ne sont pas des pays sensibles au thème de l'ingérence, ou plutôt que ce sont des pays qui ont une sensibilité négative par rapport à l'ingérence, et qui n'ont certainement pas envie d'aider diplomatiquement les pays occidentaux, ni de gêner diplomatiquement la Chine. Enfin, la Russie a très bien compris que ce qui se passe pour Pékin 2008 sert d'échauffement pour Sotchi 2014, où auront lieu les Jeux olympiques d'hiver.
对于这一问题，世界其他国家和欧洲国家的感情是不一样的。此外，那些国家都对
‘外交干预’没什么兴趣，或者说，他们都对 ‘干预’持否定态度。他们不太愿意在外交上站在西方一边，也不愿意得罪中国。最后，俄国因为Stochi在2014年举办冬季奥运会，她非常的理解现在北京的立场。
ctipar : La Chine peut-elle réagir à la prise de position des sportifs durant les Jeux ?
在奥运期间，中国将怎样回应运动员,(假如运动员们采取抗议人权/西藏问题的时候)？
Pascal Boniface : Elle ne réagira pas directement, mais demandera au CIO de le faire et là, bien sûr, il s'agit d'un rapport de forces. On peut exclure quelques sportifs qui font des actions, mais s'il y a des actions concertées qui en réunissent des centaines, il sera très difficile pour le CIO de sévir.
她不会直接的回应的，但会要求国际奥委会处理此事。假如仅仅几个运动员的抗议，不会有什么作用，但是如果是几百个运动员采取具体行动，对于奥委会将会非常的棘手。
JAA : Quel regard portez-vous sur l'action de Reporters sans frontières ?
你怎么看待记者无疆界的抗议行动？ （在点圣火的时候，无疆界在刘淇旁边举旗抗议）
Pascal Boniface : C'est une opération spectaculaire par définition, donc qui est dans la lignée de l'action de Reporters sans frontières. Mais cette action spectaculaire ne doit pas masquer une réflexion approfondie de RSF, qui est passée d'une demande de boycott en 2001 à une demande de participation active aujourd'hui.
这是无疆界的一个引人注目的行动，但仅仅是他们一系列行动中的一个。这一行动不能简单的来看，他们在2001年就已经提出了抵制圣火采集仪式的口号。
Richard : Le boycott pourrait-il avoir de réelles conséquences sur l'évolution de la Chine en général, et sur l'avenir du Tibet en particulier ?
抵制行动能不能真得起到改善中国总体环境的作用？特别是对于西藏的未来？
Pascal Boniface : En fait, il faut se méfier des réponses manichéennes à cette question. Dire que l'attitude du monde extérieur n'a aucune conséquence n'est pas exact, mais penser que l'on peut faire des injonctions à l'égard de la Chine ne l'est pas non plus. Donc, dans l'affaire, il faut analyser au plus juste comment peser sur la Chine sans la braquer et comment adapter des positions et des actions qui ne se traduisent pas par une crispation nationaliste de la Chine. Et dire cela ne veut pas dire ce qu'ont tenté de faire les communiqués : ne rien faire.
这是一个非常复杂的问题。（译者：这句话不理解，不认识manichéennes）。说外界的压力一点作用也没有，是不对的，但是认为我们能对中国发号司令，也决不可能。所以，在这一事情上，应该小心谨慎的采取适合的态度，合理的方式来向中国施压，以免激起中国的民族情绪。但是这也不是像他们（中国）表示：我们什么都不会做。
LE BOYCOTT CONCERNANT L'AFRIQUE DU SUD A ÉTÉ LE SEUL EFFICACE
jackrace_1 : Les boycotts des Jeux de Moscou ou de Los Angeles ont-ils été efficaces ?
莫斯科和洛杉矶的奥运会抵制行动，起了作用吗？
Pascal Boniface : Oui, pour permettre au pays organisateur d'avoir plus de médailles qu'il n'en aurait eu sinon. On peut cependant distinguer les deux cas. Dans le cas du boycott des Jeux de Moscou de 1980, ça a été une mesure au départ vexante et humiliante pour les Soviétiques, qui voulaient faire des Jeux un triomphe. Mais au final, une fois passée la déception, ils en ont profité pour gagner plus dans des Jeux moins universels. Et on peut dire que le boycott de 1984 a eu moins d'impact encore, dans la mesure où il a été très largement analysé comme la réponse du berger à la bergère. Et qu'il a permis un triomphe sportif aux Etats-Unis.
是的，抵制有用；让举办国拿到了更多的金牌仅此而已！！这两次其实都不一样。对莫斯科1980的抵制行动，开始的时候是为了羞辱苏联的。但是后来，反而让他们拿到了更多的金牌，因为参加的人少了。至于1984年的抵制，更加没效果，这仅仅是苏联对当年遭抵制的报复性抵制。而美国，这次也取得了体育的凯旋。
On parle toujours d'un boycott sportif qui a été efficace, c'est celui concernant l'Afrique du Sud de l'apartheid. Mais il faut se rappeler que le boycott sportif s'est accompagné d'un boycott économique très largement suivi. Et que ce boycott économique a joué beaucoup plus que le boycott sportif. Je n'entends encore personne proposer un boycott économique de la Chine.
我们所说的有效的体育抵制活动，是在南非的apartheid那次。但是那次是伴随着非常广泛的经济抵制活动。而那次经济抵制活动，造成了比体育抵制更加大的影响力。我暂时还没有听到要经济抵制中国。
Mehdi : Les dirigeants chinois n'auraient-ils pas occulté trop vite les risques que l'organisation d'une telle compétition impliquent pour un système comme le leur ?
难道中国领导人没有想到在他们这种制度下，这件事情的可能造成的风险吗？
Pascal Boniface : Je pense qu'ils ont sous-estimé l'ampleur des conséquences de la médiatisation de l'organisation d'un tel événement. Ils ont en vu les aspects positifs et en ont mésestimé les aspects potentiellement dangereux pour eux. En organisant les Jeux, ils ont attiré la lumière sur eux, c'était le but recherché. Mais l'effet non recherché, c'est qu'ils ont également attiré la lumière sur des aspects qu'ils auraient préféré garder secrets ou discrets. Car finalement, la répression chinoise au Tibet n'est pas nouvelle, et si l'on parle plus du Tibet aujourd'hui qu'auparavant, c'est bel et bien parce que les Jeux vont être organisés à Pékin au mois d'août.
我猜他们低估了这件事情上媒体大众的影响。他们仅仅把这次奥运当成一个简单的体育活动，而对这次事件形成了错误的估计，他们没有提前预料到这种潜在的危险。（译者：他们没有想到，西方媒体广泛的报道，使得北京奥运成为世界批评的焦点，他们跟本就没有预想到会有这么大的潜在的危险，而仅是想到好好办好这一活动。）中国希望通过举办奥运会吸引世界的目光，这时他们原来的想法。而这恰恰使得全世界也把目光投向了那些他们（中国）不希望别人知道的方面。其实，中国对西藏的镇压也不是第一次，这次为什么全世界都在谈论，仅仅因为北京在8月就要举行奥运会了。
ctipar : La Chine a-t-elle intérêt à étouffer tout ce qui pourrait se passer au Tibet (ou ailleurs) d'ici aux JO, ou vaut-il mieux pour elle jouer une certaine transparence vis-à-vis des médias étrangers, comme elle a tenté en vain de le faire récemment ? Je pense à la visite organisée et perturbée pour vingt-six journalistes étrangers.
中国禁止媒体自由采访西藏，能够有利于中国吗？ 还是他知道禁止是没用的，从而愿意开放更多的透明度给媒体？ 我是说，“组织”26个外国记者去西藏采访，然而又被（喇嘛）打断这件事上来说。
Pascal Boniface : La transparence est préférable à condition qu'elle soit possible et qu'elle soit crédible. Donc l'urgence pour Pékin est bien sûr de ramener le calme, mais pas au prix d'une répression qui attirerait encore plus l'attention sur son comportement.
如果能够开发透明的开放的报道，当然是好的。重要的是，北京应该尽快恢复（西藏的）平静。而不是进一步的镇压，那将会吸引更多的关注。
jack : Les Jeux olympiques vont-il devenir le moyen de montrer au monde entier les problèmes de politique intérieure des pays organisateurs ?
奥运　会不会成为一个揭示中国所有内部问题的一个机会？　
Pascal Boniface : Tout événement mondial médiatisé sera ce type d'occasion, et dès qu'un pays sera l'hôte d'un événement à forte valeur par rapport aux opinions publiques, plus il devra faire attention aux éventuelles zones d'ombre qu'il ne veut pas montrer, et il sera de plus en plus difficile à des pays dont le comportement est contesté d'organiser ce type d'événement sans le payer d'un prix fort en termes d'opinion. C'est l'une des conséquences de l'importance croissante du rôle des opinions publiques sur la politique internationale.
举办大型的国际活动，（举办方）都会遇到同样的问题。一旦一个国家举办一个吸引世界目光的大型活动时，都会可能使得他的很多不希望世人知道的问题暴露出来。从此举办国都会要更多的考虑到世界大众的观点。这也是大众观点对国际政治影响力不断增强的结果。
Richard : Lié au boycott des JO, des gens, sur des forums, suggèrent aussi un boycott économique du "made in China". Qu'en pensez-vous ?
致于论坛上说，要对中国产品　“made in china” 进行抵制。你怎么看？
Pascal Boniface : Comme pour le reste, pour être efficace, il faut qu'il soit très largement répandu et il faut qu'il y ait une adéquation entre le citoyen et le consommateur. Mais on voit souvent que le consommateur n'a pas les mêmes réflexes que le citoyen.
还是和刚才一样，只有世界性大范围的抵制，才能有效。然后，我们还要考虑到公民和消费者的区别。我们可以看到， 消费者的决定，不一定是公民的决定。
pleu : Le boycott entraînerait-il un regain de confiance des pays limitrophes permettant de débloquer les quelques conflits de la région, comme les Ouïgours dans l'ouest du pays, ou l'Inde au sujet du Cachemire ?

Pascal Boniface : Il est évident que s'il y avait un boycott, cela rendrait le gouvernement chinois plus crispé. Et en même temps, n'ayant plus à craindre de pression extérieure, il se sentirait les mains plus libres. Par ailleurs, un boycott aurait pour conséquence une dégradation du climat international qui, par définition, aura des conséquences négatives dans la région.
Turambar : Quel avenir pour le Tibet après les Jeux ?
Pascal Boniface : Il y a un scénario impossible, c'est l'indépendance. Les Chinois ne l'admettent pas et les Tibétains ne le revendiquent pas. Cela posé, il reste deux scénarios majeurs : soit les Chinois comprennent que la satisfaction de la demande d'autonomie culturelle des Tibétains n'est pas dangereuse pour eux d'un point de vue stratégique, et peut leur faciliter la vie d'un point de vue politique ; et dans ce cas-là, la situation peut s'améliorer.
Soit ils maintiennent une attitude crispée, et ils en paieront toujours un prix assez lourd en termes d'image internationale, parce que si les Tibétains ne sont pas le seul peuple opprimé sur la planète, ils sont, parmi les peuples opprimés, celui qui a la meilleure image.
Guillaume : Quel avenir pour la Chine après les Jeux de Pékin ?
Pascal Boniface : Là encore, on ne peut pas répondre de façon tranchée. C'est une question de proportion, pas une question de "oui" ou "non". La Chine est à la fois acceptée et critiquée dans la communauté internationale. Tout est affaire de proportion. A l'heure actuelle, la part de critiques est plus forte, bien sûr.
我们同样不能简单的回答这个问题。这是一个复杂的问题，不能说是还是不是。中国在国际社会，一方面会被接纳，也会受批评。这都是究织在一起的。目前的情况，当然是批评的比较多。
Maha : Est-ce que les réactions actuelles de certains gouvernements occidentaux représentent une soudaine prise de conscience de la situation entre la Chine et le Tibet, ou est-ce simplement un effet de mode qui prendra fin avec la clôture des JO ?
Pascal Boniface : C'est plutôt une réaction par rapport aux campagnes d'opinion, où les gouvernements ont suivi le train de l'opinion.
这更是政治人物对公众观点的反映，只不过是顺着民意，意思一下而已。
Richard : Qui revendique alors l'indépendance du Tibet ?
谁要求西藏的独立？
Pascal Boniface : Pas le dalaï-lama, pas la majorité des Tibétains. Quelques éléments isolés peuvent la réclamer. Il faudrait étudier de plus près la représentativité de ceux-ci. D'ailleurs, on parle beaucoup de ceux qui réclament le boycott, mais ils sont très minoritaires. Les grandes organisations de défense des droits de l'homme ne réclament pas le boycott, pas plus que le dalaï-lama. Comme ils prennent des positions radicales, on les voit plus, mais ils sont loin d'avoir une très forte audience.
不是达赖喇嘛，也不是大部分的西藏人。是少数几个孤立的群体。我们必须深一步的研究（要求西藏独立的）代表性的问题。此外，我们说的要求抵制奥运的组织，其实是非常少数。那些大的人权机构，都没有要求抵制，达赖喇嘛自己没有要求。因为他们都是激进的态度，所以我们总是看到他们，但是其实他们的听众很少．（他们没有多少支持者）。
Djan59 : Le boycott serait certes un geste symbolique très fort mais n'aurait d'effet que sur le court terme. Quels seraient, selon vous, les moyens de pression qui feraient que la Chine respecterait définitivement les droits de l'homme ?
抵制活动仅仅是一个有力的象征性的姿态，而仅仅有短期的作用。那么根据你的看法，什么样的压力怎样才能使中国绝对有效的尊重人权？
Pascal Boniface : Rêver que la Chine respecte définitivement les droits de l'homme à court ou long terme sur injonction des pays occidentaux relève de l'illusion. Et il faut sortir du schéma où l'on donne des instructions à un autre pays pour qu'il s'y conforme. Tout simplement parce que ce schéma n'est plus opératoire et qu'on n'est plus dans la situation où l'on puisse, fût-ce au nom de la morale, donner des ordres à un autre pays, surtout que notre morale est parfois considérée comme étant à géométrie variable.
指望中国听从西方的指导决对有效的尊重人权是幻想。而且我们必须跳出那种我们发号司令，别的国家听从的这种模式。原因很简单，这种模式只有在我们以我们的道义的名义，在我们有能力的时候，才能有效的下达指令。 （这种模式已经无效了，因为我们虽然在道义的一边，但是我们已经没有那种给别的国家发号司令的能力了）。跟何况的是，我们的道义，在别的国家眼里，是一个变量。 （ 我们认为是正确和正义的东西，别人去不一定这么认为）。（译者：向pascal boniface 致意！理解万岁！）

Greeddo : Dans le cas d'un scénario extrême – aggravation de la répression chinoise au Tibet, puis détérioration des tensions internationales, puis boycott total par plusieurs pays "majeurs" –, est-il concevable d'envisager une hausse des tensions pouvant aller jusqu'à un conflit armé au niveau mondial ?
我们假设一种极端情况 -- 中国在西藏的镇压进一步恶化，导致国际关系的高度紧张，世界大部分国家都抵制奥运 -- 会不会导致国际关系上升到武装冲突的层面上来。
（译者：这个记者晕了头还是真的愚蠢？都不是--这就是媒体，制造话题，不然他们吃什么？？translator: this journalist is crazy or really stupied? None, it’s their boulot—to creat topic, c’est tout）
Pascal Boniface : Par définition, rien ne peut être exclu. Mais ce scénario me paraît beaucoup plus radical que probable.
从理论上来说，什么都不可能排除。但从我看来，这种情况基本不可能。

这里的主题是有关对胡佳的政治迫害，请这里的大陆人不要跑题和灌水。

"这里的主题是有关对胡佳的政治迫害，请这里的大陆人不要跑题和灌水。"

"The topic of this discussion is Hu Jia and the politics surrounding him. I politely ask that the mainlanders here not change the subject or add spam."

Zhangsan

Sara , your in a bit of a pickle though remain optimistic...governments of China and this administration in the Us are not to be trusted. Hu Jia was put in jail and will be released soon to show the softer side of Confucius children in power. Yet, all he did was try to take care of his child and the next generation of children whom we have, because of our blind ambition and attack on the environment, forgotten.

The coldest lesson to those who will defy the 'serpent of suffering' is for the Tibetans. I still don't see what the superstitious serpents have to fear from a small religous group of people at the top of the world.

I know its none of my business but i feel the Us looks at the world as kind of a big football game and we kind of like the analogy of being a team player in the world. To look closer at China i might say that the next Manchurian candidate for premier should be John Walton of Wal-mart, but he is dead. Its not a happy marriage Us and China and i don't like it, your not a team player.
Be careful what you say, cause the and more china becomes prosperous the more you become like us. I guess that was in the contract that George Bush and the corporate elite sold you. Money not spent wisely by a gov. is no fun for anyone.

On an even playing field with healthy administrations i think China and Us in the future are going to save the world.
When we have a more democratic president we will probably do less business in China and more with maybe your nearest competition north korea.

- while George Bush is still in office maybe Us could make China the 51st state of the Union and Tibet 52nd or maybe New Shanghai for New York.

have to go...sorry for bad editing

@tom mayo

Your position sound a bit like those of the anti-establishment.

Can you put forth some proposal on how the governments (US and China) out to change to make things better in you eyes (for both the Chinese and Americans)?

Dear Readers,

A poll has gone up over at the US and China Today blog - about the recent Tibet events. Chime in and help propagate the link. Lets see what the world thinks.

"Global Poll: recent Tibet events, riot or peaceful protest?"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/global-poll-rio.html

Amnesty and all other human rights groups are EXTREMISTS, they are subjective when it comes to human rights. They will do what ever it take to gain attention, even if that means breaking down the social order and political stability. Judging by the comments here and other media coverage, Hu Jia has succeded.

@ airsand

'i'm a chinese.
so i surpport my government.'

*sigh* the nationalism. I resent nationalism, its just a euphemism for being vain. Its reasonable, but its not rational.

The Fact of the Riot In Tibet

The original text can be found at http://f117cnw.blogbus.com/logs/18310080.html|http://catalium.blogbus.com/logs/18310461.html

It was on March 14th,2008,something sorrowful happened in Lhasa,the capital of Tibetan Autonomous Region of China,which turned out to be a long planned terror activity led by cooperated anti-China powers.

In order to understand the fact better,you'd better study Chinese history a little in advance.Since Tang Dynasty's Wencheng Princess's marry to Tibet King 1400 years ago,the inner land has developed a very close relationship with Tibet,100 years ago when China was governed by Qing Dynasty,Tibetan leaders had to register in the Court to get their legal administration.By that time,Tibet had long been a part of China,in dynasties above Qing,Tibet had been inside the border of the Map of the Nation.When capitalists' revolution happened in 1911,Qing Dynasty was pulled down,but Tibet remained a feudal-slavery one.In 1949,the People's Republic was founded,in 1950,the central government liberated Tibet peacefully through negotiation,Tibetans were free from slavery and got their own land,they govern themselves under the policy of the central government that minorities could govern their lands which are called Autonomous Regions.As the general representative of old time's feudalists' interest,Danai Lama was not satisfied with the democratic progress,rebelled and fled in 1959.

On March 14th,08,many people’s rights were badly invaded by those remote controlled ruffians,including both Tibetans and Hans.Business streets were robbed,shops were broken,5 young girls working in a fashion casuals shop were even burnt to death when those tough guys set fire to that shop (if they ran out,they might be cut into pieces).Police force that kept calm when they were provoked by extremists then started to settle the out-of-order situation,several extremists self-wounded,had photos taken with prepared cameras,intending to send those fake-made photos abroad to feed certain media that do bad to China’s international image,then,they assaulted the police crazily,a policeman was even hit faint and a pound of flesh was cut off,the rescuers came to help but were attacked badly also,instruments were smashed,ambulances were destroied.So,Armed Police Force were send out immediately,settled the riot successfully,but the military trucks failed to survive.It is indeed a terror activity led by Danai who is a wolf under wool.

However,what makes people’s indignation grow is that western media including BBC,RTL,CNN,N-TV treat the terror activity without conscience of news workers’ (or even humanity),ignoring facts and report it as Peaceful Parade (IF THIS CASE SHOWS HOW THEY CALL TERROR ATTACK,THEN THE 911 CASE CAN BE DISCRIBED AS PARADE OF AEROPLANES IN THE AIR),use fake photos (processed with softwares such as Photoshop) and purposefully cut videos to contribute to their masterpiece,so that China can be demonized greatly,as many times they have ever done.eg,a photo that shows Tibetan citizens being rescued by two policemen by dragging from the chaos was quoted as Police Arrest Democrats by certain media,another two photos respectively show Nepalian police and Indian police repelling Tibetan extremists are quoted as Police Assault Democrats.There are many cases like this kind,western people have been misled many times.

An end should be put to the bias towards China.

In order to help people in western countries who are misled by media that are controlled by politicians and certain interest groups to know the fact exactly and recognize a true China at the same time,I write this article.

A Chinese senior middle school student hopes you can come to China,visit around,see it,feel it,discover something by your hearts.The experience of an old oriental country’s progress and development will be worthy of your tour!

The original text can be found at http://f117cnw.blogbus.com/logs/18310080.html

http://catalium.blogbus.com/logs/18310461.html

Hueren, i feel the term anti-establishment is antiquated and generalizes what i had to say. I've got a question for you too.. Of all the world governments tell me one that works well enough for you to live in.

Sometimes i ask myself what in the world am i doing here anyway. Half of people in the world aren't worth the dirt their standing on and the other half want to take it. Within our human condition we seem to be born with emotions that help us to survive and reproduce more suffering. and within the laws of causality every time i point the finger a someone i get a pie in the face. its a Catch 22....

Right now the spotlight is on China, the tibet situation has got to resolve itself before the olympics. all i keep hearing out of china sounds one sided without much understanding for a real lasting solution for Tibet.

If compassion is the heart beat of our inherent human nature that we share, then to allow the human rights of Tibetans to simmer into political discussion is against our true aspiration to make this a better world to live in.

Compassion is the key human component to energize ourselves in all our actions... lets say for instance that you adopt a child and you think will be a nice addition to you family. The child doesn't follow your prescribe rules and starts acting out of line... in that instant you have a choice to punish with or without violence or have 'time out' get at the cause of the problem To sit the child on your knee console, without pride, sincerely ask what has happened and is their anything i could do to help....just to listen and show respect will bring a solution! Not to say your a bad parent, but because misdeeds have a cause i reality i cannot blame the child when its being misunderstood.

ALTERNATIVES.

something the Us chose not to do in the middle east, but an approach i would like to see more countries take.

I am excited about the democratic candidates running for office in Us and pray the more moderate Us emerges in 09. This could be a great day for Obama...'don't tell ya mama i'm voting for Obama'!!!

John Smith:

"how does simon's juice taste? nice?"

look, we do have a sense of humour.

John Smith:

"how does simon's juice taste? nice?"

look, we do have a sense of humour.
John Smith:

"how does simon's juice taste? nice?"

look, we do have a sense of humour.
John Smith:

"how does simon's juice taste? nice?"

look, we do have a sense of humour.

Human Rights situation in China must be really getting better. According to US government, 76,655 US citizens obtained green card in China. This shows that Americans are leaving US for China in droves!!

How come all the trained parrots are regurgitating the same rubbish from the China Daily ? Does anyone has any other ideas ? Oh, don't tell us if it is going to endanger your personal or family's safety.

This guy must be Chinese:
http://ahmadsherif.wordpress.com/dictatorships-for-dummies/

See, all whites are just the same, anti-Chinese:
http://www.american.com/archive/2008/march-april-magazine-contents/the-atlantic-divide

Maybe 76,655 US spies obtain green card from Chinese government to form silent protest in streets of China. Ha ha!!!

i married Japanese go to Korean store and love Chinese food. not well educated but open minded. when i look in the mirror i don't confuse the image with my government. I'm not against the Chinese people and would love one day to visit rural China if the money is a available.

Talked with good friend last night who left China after working for the government, he explained what the major differences between the west and east. We laughed at how hard it is to point a finger at what i dislike about each country without sounding like a hypicrit. My main difference between us is I'm Buddhist and he's not. i still can't understand why there is so much hatred between the Han and the Tibetans. But i do know racism, black on white, red on yellow, you name it we got it and deal with it. I've got friends of every color and mixed color. But i can promise you the Han will never feel at home in Tibet and without concessions of the native tongue of the Dalai Lama.

"i'm a chinese.
so i surpport my government.

Posted by airsand | April 2, 2008 11:01 PM "

I'm a human, and China's government must burn for its crimes against humanity, especially its own people. And Mao's big, ugly picture will be torched soon.

大致看了一下BBC中文论坛的中国人对于胡佳事件的看法，看起来，中国人的意见也各不相同
这是BBC中文论坛讨论的地址，不过里面大部分都是中文
http://newsforums.bbc.co.uk/ws/thread.jspa?sortBy=1&forumID=5855&start=0&tstart=0#paginator

有些人表示对胡佳的同情，有人表示对胡佳的质疑。
其中有人说胡佳接受CIA的资助，还有一个人这样说：
“2006年NED（美国国家民主基金会，专搞颜色革命的机构）给他十八万（$179,113）美元，还有 什么好说的？大家可以到美国国家民主基金会的网站上去查。******** ograms/grants-asia06.html#china”

另一个人则留言说：
“我就不懂 胡佳两口子 没正式工作，靠那几篇破文章稿费， 怎么还养房养车，还周游列国参加培训。

中国政府该管管这在中国四处泛滥的 西方基金会的funding了。”

我不知道对于留言的真假，也仅供各位多一种判断

很高兴，还能看到张三同学，谢谢你的翻译 ：）

更正一下，应该是“我不知道这些留言的真假”

而我自己的意见是，无论如何，出于人道主义的角度，我同情胡佳的处境和他年幼的小孩
但是如果他真的违反了法律，那么他就应该承担后果

遗憾的是，由于国内看不到太多关于胡佳的新闻和讨论，我无法做出准确判断---这也是我一直坚持批评和诟病的一个方面，政府限制太多新闻自由！

不过老实说，SIMON也知道天涯论坛，那上面骂共产党的文章太多了。。。
所以，我多少有点倾向于认为胡佳被捕不仅仅是几篇文章那么简单，可能是他和国外的一些集团势力有瓜葛，比如法轮功等等

还是BBC中文论坛上的留言，不知道真假，仅供各位参考：

事实上，也有许多人借这种苦肉计来换得一张绿卡。我认识一个福州人。他故意策动
他的朋友叛逃，结果坐了两三 年牢。出牢后就偷渡到美国，申请避难成功。我是学
生，餐馆打工时认识了他。他吹嘘起这段经历，才知道竟有这种事。现在此人在美
国过着幸福的洗碗工生活。魏金生不也是一样？不学无术，来了美国，每天梦想有
一天回去当中国总统。而事实上他是个无照抄速开车，连马路上交通标志都看不懂
的文盲(这些事实都在美国新闻周刊上报道过)。
胡佳写了什么，我不清楚。不过我知道如果无关紧要，大陆才不会用牛刀来杀这样
一个毛头小子。我在国内的朋友里，骂政府的人可多了，每个都平安无事。
BBC 及西方不会错过任何攻击中国的机会。胡佳只是可以利用的一个棋子。反正，
欢迎胡佳来美国洗碗。现在也很难找到有绿卡的洗碗工。

（post by）wang atlanta, USA

the spin out of control...government does cart-wheel around human rights...while army smashes tibet infidels like squash fly.

narcissism - The terms "narcissism", "narcissistic" and "narcissist" are often used as pejoratives, denoting vanity, conceit, egotism or simple selfishness. Applied to a social group, it is sometimes used to denote elitism or an indifference to the plight of others. Arguably, however, these terms are used to draw parallels between allegations of self-centeredness and Narcissistic personality disorder, rather than toward healthy self love.

the new age... for chinese carpet baggers to raise the banner to praise the wise Confusius governments decision to bring Narcissism as important emotion to extinguish the smell of discontent rising from olympic hopes.

some intellectual disagree on chinese government narcissist approach to human rights:
. Twelve Suggestions for Dealing with the Tibetan Situation
by Some Intellectuals

Beijing, March 22, 2008

1. At present the one-sided propaganda of the official Chinese media is having the effect of stirring up inter-ethnic animosity and aggravating an already tense situation. This is extremely detrimental to the long-term goal of safeguarding national unity. We call for such propaganda to be stopped.

2. We support the Dalai Lama’s appeal for peace, and hope that the ethnic conflict can be dealt with according to the principles of goodwill, peace, and non-violence. We condemn any violent act against innocent people, strongly urge the Chinese government to stop the violent suppression, and appeal to the Tibetan people likewise not to engage in violent activities.

3. The Chinese government claims that “there is sufficient evidence to prove this incident was organized, premeditated, and meticulously orchestrated by the Dalai clique." We hope that the government will show proof of this. In order to change the international community’s negative view and distrustful attitude, we also suggest that the government invite the United Nation’s Commission on Human Rights to carry out an independent investigation of the evidence, the course of the incident, the number of casualties, etc.

4. In our opinion, such Cultural-Revolution-like language as “the Dalai Lama is a jackal in Buddhist monk’s robes and an evil spirit with a human face and the heart of a beast ” used by the Chinese Communist Party leadership in the Tibet Autonomous Region is of no help in easing the situation, nor is it beneficial to the Chinese government’s image. As the Chinese government is committed to integrating into the international community, we maintain that it should display a style of governing that conforms to the standards of modern civilization.

5. We note that on the very day when the violence erupted in Lhasa (March 14), the leaders of the Tibet Autonomous Region declared that “there is sufficient evidence to prove this incident was organized, premeditated, and meticulously orchestrated by the Dalai clique.” This shows that the authorities in Tibet knew in advance that the riot would occur, yet did nothing effective to prevent the incident from happening or escalating. If there was a dereliction of duty, a serious investigation must be carried out to determine this and deal with it accordingly.

6. If in the end it cannot be proved that this was an organized, premeditated, and meticulously orchestrated event but was instead a “popular revolt” triggered by events, then the authorities should pursue those responsible for inciting the popular revolt and concocting false information to deceive the Central Government and the people; they should also seriously reflect on what can be learned from this event so as to avoid taking the same course in the future.

7. We strongly demand that the authorities not subject every Tibetan to political investigation or revenge. The trials of those who have been arrested must be carried out according to judicial procedures that are open, just, and transparent so as to ensure that all parties are satisfied.

8. We urge the Chinese government to allow credible national and international media to go into Tibetan areas to conduct independent interviews and news reports. In our view, the current news blockade cannot gain credit with the Chinese people or the international community, and is harmful to the credibility of the Chinese government. If the government grasps the true situation, it need not fear challenges. Only by adopting an open attitude can we turn around the international community’s distrust of our government.

9. We appeal to the Chinese people and overseas Chinese to be calm and tolerant, and to reflect deeply on what is happening. Adopting a posture of aggressive nationalism will only invite antipathy from the international community and harm China’s international image.

10. The disturbances in Tibet in the 1980s were limited to Lhasa, whereas this time they have spread to many Tibetan areas. This deterioration indicates that there are serious mistakes in the work that has been done with regard to Tibet. The relevant government departments must conscientiously reflect upon this matter, examine their failures, and fundamentally change the failed nationality policies.

11. In order to prevent similar incidents from happening in future, the government must abide by the freedom of religious belief and the freedom of speech explicitly enshrined in the Chinese Constitution, thereby allowing the Tibetan people fully to express their grievances and hopes, and permitting citizens of all nationalities freely to criticize and make suggestions regarding the government’s nationality policies.

12. We hold that we must eliminate animosity and bring about national reconciliation, not continue to increase divisions between nationalities. A country that wishes to avoid the partition of its territory must first avoid divisions among its nationalities. Therefore, we appeal to the leaders of our country to hold direct dialogue with the Dalai Lama. We hope that the Chinese and Tibetan people will do away with the misunderstandings between them, develop their interactions with each other, and achieve unity. Government departments as much as popular organizations and religious figures should make great efforts toward this goal.

Signatures:

Wang Lixiong (Beijing, Writer)
Liu Xiaobo (Beijing, Freelance Writer)
Zhang Zuhua (Beijing, scholar of constitutionalism)
Sha Yexin (Shanghai, writer, Chinese Muslim)
Yu Haocheng (Beijing, jurist)
Ding Zilin (Beijing, professor)
Jiang peikun (Beijing, professor)
Yu Jie (Beijing, writer)
Sun Wenguang (Shangdong, professor)
Ran Yunfei (Sichuan, editor, Tujia nationality)
Pu Zhiqiang (Beijing, lawyer)
Teng Biao (Beijing, Layer and scholar)
Liao Yiwu ()Sichuan, writer)
Wang Qisheng (Beijing, scholar)
Zhang Xianling (Beijing, engineer)
Xu Jue (Beijing, research fellow)
Li Jun (Gansu, photographer)
Gao Yu (Beijing, journalist)
Wang Debang (Beijing, freelance writer)
Zhao Dagong (Shenzhen, freelance writer)
Jiang Danwen (Shanghai, writer)
Liu Yi (Gansu, painter)
Xu Hui (Beijing, writer)
Wang Tiancheng (Beijing, scholar)
Wen kejian (Hangzhou, freelance)
Li Hai (Beijing, freelance writer)
Tian Yongde (Inner Mongolia, folk human rights activists)
Zan Aizong (Hangzhou, journalist)
Liu Yiming (Hubei, freelance writer)
Liu Di (Beijing, freelance writer)

i hope this is helpful...is this information open to the public in China?

@tom mayo

"Of all the world governments tell me one that works well enough for you to live in."

Most of the governments on this planet work well enough - including China's and USA's. What is your answer to that?

You spoke of "compassion" - how about compassion for the 1.3 billion Chinese? Most people (outside of USA/UK) consider your support for Tibetan separatist perspectives actually perpuates violence in the long run - which is the worst case scenario. Much of that has been discuss in this forums before.

Lastly, what do you say about the recent US/UK biased coverage of the Lahsa riots?

'US/UK biased coverage of the Lahsa riots'?

the coverage is atrocious and an insult to the free world and freedom loving people everywhere. their should be a independent news agency in each monastery as we speak so the news can be monitored fairly.

'Most of the governments on this planet work well enough - including China's and USA's. What is your answer to that'?

So your content with the situation in Tibet? Under Chinese colonialism of Tibet do you have a solution for peace thats acceptable to most Tibetans...

'You spoke of "compassion" - how about compassion for the 1.3 billion Chinese'

COMPASSION- from WIKIPEDIA online encyclopedia

Compassion is an understanding of the emotional state of another or oneself. Not to be confused with empathy, compassion is often combined with a desire to alleviate or reduce the suffering of another or to show special kindness to those who suffer. However, compassion may lead an individual to feel empathy with another person.

I do not wish to characterize all Chinese as bad people. China itself has a beautiful culture. Many Chinese have spoken out in support of Tibet and the Dalai Lama, which sadly has been hardly mentioned by the media (perhaps one of the few instances of bias in this case, as it leads to the assumption that all Chinese support the colonial rule over Tibet).

I've missed the history of your forum.
Just out of curiosity... where do you get your information?

@tom mayo

Man, you are joing this party way late! Go back to Simon Elegant's first attempt at arguing Tibet Independence. Read the arguments in the reader comments sections.

1. Then go and read "Free Tibet?" by Liam O Ruairc (an Irish, mind you), here:

"Free Tibet?"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/free-tibet.html

2. Also, another book, "The Snow Lion and the Dragon:China, Tibet, and the Dalai Lama" by Melvyn C. Goldstein.

3. Also, read the forum discussions over at New York Times:

"Nicholas D. Kristof over at New York Times asks: "What do we get wrong, and why?""

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/nicholas-d-kris.html

4. And finally, check how the world is responding to this poll:

"poll: recent Tibet events, riot or peaceful protest?"

http://www.uschinatoday.com/uschinatoday/2008/04/global-poll-rio.html

Good stuff:
http://www.mingpaonews.com/20080407/07nh101.gif

I took part in peaceful demonstrations in London, but not to disrupt it. Most others felt the same way.

China promised to improve Human Rights when the Olympic games were awared. However the events in the last few years demonstrate otherwise:

a) China has increased the crackdown on internal dissidents. For example the recent conviction by a Chinese court of long-time HIV/AIDS activist and rights defender Hu Jia.

b) Organ harvesting and related extrajudicial executions in Chinese labour camps. This is to supply transplants to foreign and wealthly Chinese clients as demonstrated in a BBC investigation. Infact executions at prisons were steeped up to meet excess demand in the nearby transplant hospital.

c) Ethic cleansing and cultural genocide of minorities, mainly Tibetans and Uyghurs in rural provinces in the west of China. This has taken place since the 1950s with th