February 2, 2007 8:03
Black People Love Us
There's is probably something to the speculation that Barack Obama is somehow not "black enough" to win overwhelming support from black voters in the Democratic primary. But in this case "something" seems to mean reporters going to editors and saying "I have asked black people about the issue and they have opinions on it." Here, I can do it, too: One (black) neighbor of mine observed of Obama, "Sure, compared to Hillary, he's black. But Bill's blacker than both of them." And when black voters failed to turn out for Michael Steele in Maryland's senate race last year, there was slightly better than anecdotal evidence that they saw him -- as another African-American gentleman I spoke to (See!) put it -- "fake."
But there's a difference between not voting for a black Republican in a general election because you think he doesn't represent the historic interests of your demographic group and not voting for a black Democrat in primary because... well, I still can't quite understand what it is that black voters would be punishing Barack for. Al Sharpton, in his visit to the Hill last week, alluded to Obama having somehow less concern for civil rights issues than he should. Is the bar for such concern higher for him than it is for Hillary?
What's more, reporters seem to have discovered the supposed intra-race ambivalence for Obama only very recently. Almost unfailingly, reporters covered Obama's fundraising and press stops in the 2006 campaign as "attempts by INSERT CANDIDATE HERE to raise his profile/curry favor with black voters." Obama performed this service for Steele's opponent, Ben Cardin, Robert Menendez, and Jim Webb. By this logic, Obama is "black enough" to help white and Hispanic candidates -- but mysteriously, not enough to help himself.
I think I'd take these stories (A dozen and counting! Including here, here, here, and here.) more seriously if they could point to substantive issues on which Obama's policies are somehow less favorable to black constituents and Hillary's policies are more beneficial, but, if anything, Hillary's moderate positions on Iraq (compared to Obama's) would seem to be a strike against her with black Democrats, who have opposed the war more strenuously than whites almost since its beginning. On affirmative action, the two Senators' positions are almost identical.
Of course, Hillary has suffered through the female version of this kind of special-class-yardsticking; Chris Matthews, for one, seems unconvinced that women like Hillary, despite numerous polls showing that they, in fact, do. I suspect that black support for Obama will increase as black voters get to know him. They will get to like Obama even more once they get to know Joe Biden.
COMEDY-KILLING POSTSCRIPT: I think Joe Biden is probably not ruined by his Obama-is-clean gaffe, if only because I'm sure he'll keep talking like that (unscripted, perhaps unwise, but without true malice) through the rest of his campaign. Something else will likely get everyone's attention soon.
COMEDY-REVIVING POSTSCRIPT: Headline explained here.
About Swampland
Ana Marie Cox is the founding editor of Wonkette and the author of the novel Dog Days. Read more
Joe Klein is TIME's political columnist and author of six books, most recently Politics Lost. Read more
Karen Tumulty is TIME's National Political Correspondent and has also covered the White House and Congress. Read more
Jay Carney is TIME's Washington bureau chief. He has covered the Clinton and Bush 43 White Houses as well as Congress. Read more
Jay Newton-Small has covered the Bush 43 White House and Congress since the DeLay era. Read more
Michael Scherer is a TIME Washington bureau correspondent covering the 2008 presidential campaign. Read more
Mike Murphy is a GOP consultant and was a senior strategist for John McCain's 2000 presidential campaign. Read more
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Reader Comments (31)
And Joe has performed for Barack the invaluable service of giving him OutKast's "So Fresh and So Clean" as campaign music. I forgave him already.
Posted by rick | February 2, 2007 9:12 PM
Time's Jonathan Daniel has an article with an excellent perspective on the Biden statement from his African-American viewpoint. It appears on Time magazine's webpage under "Most Popular". It was the #1 article when I last checked. Most DC reporters are clueless about the views of non-White ethnic groups. Only a very narrow point of view is presented. Bob Herbert of the NYT was right about Iraq. Herbert writes about Katrina, the middle class and other issues in his NYT column. Yet, Bill Kristol and a multitude of others who have been incorrect repeatedly are recurrent MSM news show guests.
A city was destroyed yet DC reporters are enamored with style questions and making sure to slam Hillary Rodham Clinton for sport. NOLA obviously has nothing to do with how the country could handle a massive terrorist strike. Welcome to modern media.
Concerning the Black vote, Colin Powell did not have the same high positives in the Black community as he did among Whites. Michael Steele did manage to get 25% of the Black vote, much more than a White Republican gubernatorial candidate could have wished for. Al Sharpton got less than half the votes of either Kerry or Edwards in the South Carolina Democratic Presidential primary. Sharpton's low Black vote happened even though 50% of SC Democrats are Black. If memory serves Sharpton also did poorly in NYC among Blacks. The point is Blacks do not vote in lock-sep for a Black candidate. They look at the issues.
As Obama's story is told and his platform is ironed out, he'll get a closer look. It's February 2007. People are focused on Iraq, what Congress is going to do, and grabbing the remote whenever GW comes on. There is time for Obama to introduce himself. When he eventually comes to Black radio stations and media, real reporters will ask real questions about real issues that impact the Black community and the country. No style questions.
You may remember that OJ Simpson came on BET (Black Entertainment Television) and was interviewed by a Black reporter, Ed Gordon. Simpson crumbled under the questioning. White reporters invited Gordon on their shows. They were amazed that OJ didn't receive kid gove treatment. The bottom line the Black community will decide about Obama after he faces the reality based Black media.
Posted by rmrd0000 | February 2, 2007 10:05 PM
"Most DC reporters are clueless about the views of non-White ethnic groups."
It's actually worse than than. Most DC reporters are also clueless about middle-class white people, too. They operate in that DC bubble that seems to inhibit their ability to empathize with the rest of the nation.
Posted by global yokel | February 2, 2007 10:53 PM
Our local Pittsburgh panel discussion program featured The Black Panelist going off on how Biden was really foolish and unpresidential, but then A White Panelist put her on the spot to ask, "So, do you think Joe Biden is racist?" and she said, "Well ... no, no I really don't."
As someone who declared themselves pro-Joe in a previous comment, I must defend him. We currently have a president with the endearing human flaw of not being inarticulate, and inable to speak well. If the American electorate can accept that, I think we can accept a candidate with the endearing human flaw of loving the sound of his own voice, and getting into trouble by speaking way too freely. I kind of wish we had been given that same opportunity in 2004 (HOWARD DEAN), but I'd be happy to take it now.
Posted by Bram Reichbaum | February 2, 2007 11:36 PM
It's actually worse than than. Most DC reporters are also clueless about middle-class white people, too. They operate in that DC bubble that seems to inhibit their ability to empathize with the rest of the nation.
You will get no disagreement from me. The point I was making was specific to Obama and the Black community's support mentioned in Ms. Cox's blog.
Today Chris Mathews had Ann Lewis, a longtime Democratic activist as a guest. He started off saying that he wanted to talk about substance during the campaign. The first question: "Would Hillary be able to get Bill to "behave" during the campaign?". He repeated this question several times. Ms Lewis reminded him that NYT had done a front page story about the Clinton marriage and found that "there was no there there". Not willing to relent Mathews then said: "So this stuff will keep going on during the campaign, huh?". He then repeated the question of whether Hillary could get Bill to behave.
The DC media lives in there own "above it all"
circle. They know the responses they want from the questions they ask. A candidate who gives the "wrong" response is belittled. If a candidate gives a proper response and the candidate is not liked, they are labeled phonies. Media Matters has a section on HRC detailing. the constant bias she is faced with by MSM.
Reporters have decided who is "a phony", "inexperienced", a straight-shooter" or maverick"
"a foreign policy expert", etc. The script is written. Since Black media still has to answer to their audience, the questions they ask are weightier. There is at least a chance to get true information. This is better then seeing a DC reporter asking questions to entertain themselves. Sometimes the question is just to put a candidte on the spot fror their pleasure. "The election is more than 12 months away, where is your detailed plan for X. DC media's main product is self-entertainment. Information is something that is an occasional by-product.
Posted by rmrd0000 | February 3, 2007 12:08 AM
If Chris Matthews thinks that only "uppity" and "militant" (his words) women like Hillary, he's in denial. My 75 year old catholic, stay-at-home mother-of-five "strongly" (her words) disagrees with him. Further, upon learning of Matthews recent stint as a bikini-pagent judge, she also thinks that his opinions don't count for very much.
Posted by JoeCHI | February 3, 2007 12:45 AM
I've never seen such backpedaling leftist sniveling and equivocating as that which has followed Biden's latest lame attempt to make himself hip in the eyes of his fellow bigot Frenchmen.
Let's cut the crap, shall we?
The loon left has provided ZERO to minorities in the country in the last 30 years, other than defense of the state status quotas (unionized federal jobs, bogus Medicaid, bogus disability coverage, pandering to defective teacher associations).
Clinton was dragged kicking and screaming to sign off on welfare reform and balancing the budget (Newt's ideas), while getting a free press pass on NAFTA and China trade policy.
Harsh DNC reality: As minority members gain economic clout through hard work and smarts (not handouts and policy tweaks), they will run in droves to the GOP.
TV Chuck Schumer can keep his thin-skinned, AARP suckling Mr. & Mrs. Barrister from Brookless.
The real deal Big Tent of merit IS in the Republican Party - and has been for decades.
Posted by QUESTION HILLARY | February 3, 2007 5:44 AM
"We currently have a president with the endearing human flaw of not being inarticulate, and inable to speak well."
This was satire, correct - or is you like me a Pell Grant grajeut?
Posted by Janet Cooker | February 3, 2007 5:49 AM
TM offers a page to an intelligent person - that's new.
Fortunately, I saw neoconservative Krisol's comments were the most popular page read of the magazine.
In his article "How the Dems have lost their cool", Kristol is kind enough to explains Liberals that their antiwar behavior will probaly cost them '08.
PS : I prefer a President like Bush who maybe doesn't speak perfect english but act properly than a President like Clinton who let killed 3'000 of his countrymen on 9/11 because he spent more time in the Oval Office having sex than defending his country.
Posted by drzz | February 3, 2007 7:24 AM
The left is liked by the minority because Democrats gives money to the poor.
Not to let them become rich. No. To let stay poor and continue to vote Democrats.
Libs love to assist people, not to help them act by themselves. It is a socialist way of thinking.
And like everybody knows, socialism leads to disaster.
Dems are children in a world of adults.
Remember this : liberals live in America. Conservatives made her.
Posted by drzz | February 3, 2007 7:40 AM
QUIZ
To drzz and Question Hillary:
Who benefitted most from affirmative action?
A) Condoleeza Rice
B) Colin Powell
C) Goerge W Bush
Answer: Inarticulate, Sammy Sosa trading, oil business money losing, non-aircarft flying, george W Bush
The other two actually did hard work and sacrifice to rise through the ranks of academia and the military becoming Stanford Provost and Chairman Of The Joint Chiefs, respectively.
NEXT Question (Essay Form)
Who were the Lily-Whites and what role did they play in the history of the GOP?
Posted by rmrd0000 | February 3, 2007 8:46 AM
Just remember, Drzz is an admitted BinLaden supporter. Everything he says is done to help Bin Laden.
QUESTION HILLARY is a known smut peddler and an enemy to traditional American Values.
Posted by Anonymous | February 3, 2007 9:30 AM
I don't understand the second sentence, which suggests that the press accounts in question are based on anecdotal interviews. I don't understand it because I read the first sentence; it links to a NYT article which says that a recent WashPost/ABC poll "found that 20 percent of black voters surveyed supported Mr. Obama while 60 percent supported Mrs. Clinton." Those numbers could change, and it's only one poll. But the numbers aren't anecdotal, and they're rather striking.
Posted by bob somerby | February 3, 2007 9:33 AM
Hey drzz,
I've noticed that you're not a native speaker of English. You make mistakes in idiom that a native speaker wouldn't make.
What's your immigration status, pal?
Posted by Tom Tancredo | February 3, 2007 10:22 AM
Dear Grand Inquisitor of Scottsdale (i.e., "question hillary"):
Do you think Black people don't know that the lily-white Republican Party is the party of choice for racist crackers? It's been this way ever since LBJ's push on the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Voting Rights Act of 1965 led the Dixiecrats to flee the Democratic Party. Racists and other ignorant rednecks ran into the welcoming arms of the Republicans, where they've lodged ever since. Just look at the sea of lily-white faces at the Republican National Conventions and compare it with the diversity of the Democrats. Which party looks more like the demographic composition of America?
But then again, maybe you don't get out much. According to the 2000 census data, the racial makeup of Scottsdale, AZ was 92.19% White, 1.23% Black or African American, 0.61% Native American, 1.96% Asian, 0.08% Pacific Islander, 2.27% from other races, and 1.65% from two or more races. 6.96% of the population were Hispanic or Latino of any race.
Call me when African Americans start voting for you guys in "droves," cracker.
What IS is.
Posted by Anonymous | February 3, 2007 10:45 AM
Of course what Biden says is fine. People shouldn't be attacking him.
It is as Jay Carney said on Hardball, that African-American candidates before Obama were mainstream because they were part of the civil rights movement.
Carney, is of course, exactly right (wing). All those poeple who were in favor of Jim Crow were the ones in the "main stream."
Nah, no racism here, move along.
Posted by fred | February 3, 2007 11:01 AM
Hey, it IS mainstream to oppose civil rights
Posted by Question Hillary | February 3, 2007 11:05 AM
We need to return to our conservative roots where black people know their place
Posted by drzz | February 3, 2007 11:07 AM
Janet: I'm afraid that wasn't satire. You just caught me BWI. I figure if that's appropriate in any forum, its this one.
Could this all be a net plus for Biden? I.e., people are now actually aware he's running for president, now? Because the perpetual announcements weren't getting the job done.
Posted by Bram Reichbaum | February 3, 2007 3:55 PM
"And Joe has performed for Barack the invaluable service of giving him OutKast's "So Fresh and So Clean" as campaign music. I forgave him already."
Hell yeah. That's a great idea, it's got a nice relaxed yet upbeat vibe to it. Good intro music. You need to get on Obama's campaign staff.
Posted by Anonymous | February 3, 2007 4:16 PM
obama's personality is so complex. If you want to uncover him read 'Dreams from my father'. He opens up a lot in this classic.
Biden is the exact opposite: I you want to uncover him read between the lines in his gaffe.
personally, if we're going to vote outside the issues and look for an American who embodies present day american let's go for barack.
Posted by neil | February 3, 2007 7:41 PM
Huh. I remember that coon show staged at the last Republican National Convention. That's the extent of conservative outreach to the black minority in America. Watching those rich old white gals with funny hats clapping off-beat to the Black gospel choir and the presumption that that was suppose to appeal to ME was a hoot. Conservatives don't give you the time of day if you're less than middle-class. You have no presence. You have no humanity because you have no assets. We are just an inconvenient truth to borrow a phrase. A few "exceptional people" get in like Powell, "oil tanker" Rice or that guy who was running for Senate in Virginia whose the latest media negro. He's impeccably dressed and has nice white teeth. drzz and Question Hilary are not among the hypocrites. They know what time it is. I am very choicey. I'm waiting to hear what Obama really has to say directly to me as well as the rest of the Dems. But don't assume that that will drive me into the arms of the Republicans. They are pure hell.They've proven this time and time again. Katrina showed me how much they value my life and my property. Both major political parties are going to have to learn that there's a whole bunch of us out here that aren't following some preacher,waiting for a ham and know all the "buzz" words. We have enough self-respect to
know this hoopla over Biden is "entertainment" a distraction from the serious life-threatening problems we all must face. Right now the only mainstream leadership that has my attention is the Congressional Black Caucus. They struggle to keep the real issues on the table and in the public discourse for the nation's marginalized - but I've got to watch C-Span to hear them. MSM conducts very few interviews with these people. Yes, Black people watch C-Span! and read the news and everyday I have to live with the rhetorical trash flung at me by neocon nutballs.I swear I get "white people" fatique. Can you blame me?
Posted by rosieparks | February 3, 2007 10:02 PM
Oh. Sorry. That brother was running for the Senate in Maryland - not Virginia. Hey, I think Jim Webb is cool. A non "cheesing" straight-up dude. I wish he was running for Prez.
Posted by rosieparks | February 3, 2007 10:10 PM
Oh. Sorry. That brother Michael Steel was running for the Senate in Maryland - not Virginia. Hey, I think Jim Webb is cool. A non "cheesing" straight-up dude. I wish he was running for Prez. Hes clear - like drzz and "Questioniing Hillary" who are clearly bigots. When you start talking about traditional American values, does that include genocide and slavery too?
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Posted by 3hod | August 15, 2008 7:56 PM